No suspension of Pembrokeshire County Council chief executive as vital meeting descends into absolute farce

No suspension of Pembrokeshire County Council chief executive as vital meeting descends into absolute farce

No suspension of Pembrokeshire County Council chief executive as vital meeting descends into absolute farce

First published in News
Last updated

A MOVE to suspend Pembrokeshire County Council chief executive Bryn Parry-Jones over thousands of pounds of ‘unlawful’ pension payments turned into absolute farce at County Hall today (Friday).

Discussing the controversial pay supplement arrangements which have sparked a police investigation for the very first time, several members had signed a notice of motion to suspend the chief executive while investigations continue.

But in astonishing scenes, counsel employed by the council, Timothy Kerr QC, read out a list of councillors who he believed may be in breach of the councillors’ code of conduct if they decided to participate in the debate, having made what he perceived to be prejudicial comments on the subject when approached by the local press prior to the meeting.

The Western Telegraph, and other local press, had previously surveyed members’ opinions as to whether Mr Parry-Jones should step down.

Some replied saying yes, some no, others declined to give a comment.

Mr Kerr said he had been passed an envelope of press cuttings by council monitoring officer Laurence Harding and asked to give an opinion whether members had predetermined the issue.

Mr Kerr read a list that included councillors Mike and Viv Stoddart, Guy Woodham, Paul Miller, Jacob Williams and Rhys Sinnett among others.

Mr Kerr had been given a photocopy of a press article and he then prepared the list of ten names.

However, some councillors argued that Mr Kerr appeared to have only highlighted members who agreed that the chief executive should step down, not those who had supported his position.

But some councillors who did support the chief executive, also left.

Councillors then had to decide whether to continue to the vote on the suspension of the chief executive – and put themselves at risk of breaking the code of conduct - or leave the chamber.

Reluctantly, members began to leave.

Cllr Sinnett, who had told the Western Telegraph that the chief exec should resign, said: “I stand by my comments in the press 100% and will now leave the chamber.”

Labour leader Cllr Paul Miller had originally said his group would remain for the vote but as more and more members left, he and his group also walked out, followed by other independent and non-affiliated members.

Cllr Miller labelled the meeting “a disgrace.”

Cllr Bob Kilmister, one of the few who remained in the chamber, said: "This is not democracy. The people of Pembrokeshire will judge you on your actions. They will not be satisfied".

Cllr Jonathan Nutting said it was a debacle.

But cabinet member Sue Perkins – a member of the Senior Staff Committee that originally took the decision over the pension arrangements, said: “This is not a shock, everyone knows that you cannot predetermine an issue.”

Following the meeting, Cllr Miller told the Western Telegraph: “This was completely embarrassing. The ruling group tried to stop democratically elected members of the opposition voting about whether the chief executive should be suspended. They did everything in their power to stop it coming up. But they won’t stop us - we will find a way to ensure that this is tabled."

He added: "Unmarked envelopes with selective press cuttings left anonymously in cars in an attempt to subvert the democratic process is something you’d expect in a Hollywood film not a 21st century council chamber.

"The council leadership has acted disgracefully to stop any discussion on the possible suspension of the chief executive, flying in the face of the will of the people of Pembrokeshire.

“The reassurance rightly sought by the public that this serious issue be dealt with properly, fairly and in a timely manner has been outrageously rubbished by a small cabal of councillors. I will continue to lead the fight for justice and refuse to let this puppet administration undermine democracy in Pembrokeshire.”

Earlier, members had voted to agree to the Wales Audit Office recommendations to remove the option of senior officers to opt out of the local government pension scheme and receive the equivalent of the employers’ contributions as part of salary.

The Wales Audit Office declared the scheme unlawful.

See much more on this story in Wednesday's Western Telegraph.

Comments (91)

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4:17pm Fri 14 Feb 14

Justiceforall says...

Surely this goes to prove that most of our Council members are not up to the job of being Councillors. Some heads should roll!

.
Surely this goes to prove that most of our Council members are not up to the job of being Councillors. Some heads should roll! . Justiceforall
  • Score: 55

4:23pm Fri 14 Feb 14

teifion says...

They really are dirty fighters hanging on for as long as they can, it's embarassing for them BUT I guess they realise it could be their assets sequestred, heavy fines even jail who can blame the rats!

Seriously,trying to stop councillors voting MUST be illegal?
They really are dirty fighters hanging on for as long as they can, it's embarassing for them BUT I guess they realise it could be their assets sequestred, heavy fines even jail who can blame the rats! Seriously,trying to stop councillors voting MUST be illegal? teifion
  • Score: 56

4:24pm Fri 14 Feb 14

Pembrokeshireboy72 says...

Fine, if that's the way they want to play it, let's get the police in there, and allow the First Minister and his team to go through every minute detail of the senior members' files. Remember, ladies and gentlemen, that all it takes is one weak link in the chain and the whole thing will tumble down. The we'll see how much your lawyers can do.
Fine, if that's the way they want to play it, let's get the police in there, and allow the First Minister and his team to go through every minute detail of the senior members' files. Remember, ladies and gentlemen, that all it takes is one weak link in the chain and the whole thing will tumble down. The we'll see how much your lawyers can do. Pembrokeshireboy72
  • Score: 62

4:37pm Fri 14 Feb 14

quentin says...

More money in the lawyers pockets. Timothy Kerr QC, employed by the council, paid by you and me. Not for nothing is it called the Kremlin.
More money in the lawyers pockets. Timothy Kerr QC, employed by the council, paid by you and me. Not for nothing is it called the Kremlin. quentin
  • Score: 60

4:45pm Fri 14 Feb 14

hardcheese says...

The people of Pembrokeshire have a right to know the councillors who are backing up Bryn Parry-Jones..We will keep fighting until we get the truth.
The people of Pembrokeshire have a right to know the councillors who are backing up Bryn Parry-Jones..We will keep fighting until we get the truth. hardcheese
  • Score: 46

4:50pm Fri 14 Feb 14

chizy says...

Farce is a polite way of putting it.

Still, a nice little earner for Mr Kerr.

The poo will hit the fan and the mob denying the wrong doing know it.

All in good time................
.
Farce is a polite way of putting it. Still, a nice little earner for Mr Kerr. The poo will hit the fan and the mob denying the wrong doing know it. All in good time................ . chizy
  • Score: 42

4:53pm Fri 14 Feb 14

Gogledd says...

I watched it from the start it was as said a disgrace, a sham, words fail me.
I watched it from the start it was as said a disgrace, a sham, words fail me. Gogledd
  • Score: 39

5:01pm Fri 14 Feb 14

williamsmum says...

You or I would not get away with this so why is he above the law?? It's just disgraceful and don't tell me he doesn't know it!
Yet more shame bought on Pembrokeshire.
You or I would not get away with this so why is he above the law?? It's just disgraceful and don't tell me he doesn't know it! Yet more shame bought on Pembrokeshire. williamsmum
  • Score: 48

5:11pm Fri 14 Feb 14

ukwoody says...

If any other council employee was to be investigated by the police they would be suspended. Therefore he should be too. It is a disgrace, he hasn't even got the guts to stand down voluntarily pending the investigation.

The Welsh assembly are just looking for reasons to do away with our council and this just feeds straight into their hands. Corruption, literally to the top.
If any other council employee was to be investigated by the police they would be suspended. Therefore he should be too. It is a disgrace, he hasn't even got the guts to stand down voluntarily pending the investigation. The Welsh assembly are just looking for reasons to do away with our council and this just feeds straight into their hands. Corruption, literally to the top. ukwoody
  • Score: 50

5:13pm Fri 14 Feb 14

SM1968 says...

Appears that Bryn and Co are think they are now so far above the law and the electorate that they can and are attempting to stifle and crush democracy, it wont work, the people will have their say!!!!!
Appears that Bryn and Co are think they are now so far above the law and the electorate that they can and are attempting to stifle and crush democracy, it wont work, the people will have their say!!!!! SM1968
  • Score: 49

6:25pm Fri 14 Feb 14

Welshman23 says...

Having listened to this debate I have never heard so much **** coming out of the mouth of the leader of the council, they used the BPJ office because the other rooms were being used by Hywel Dda for a meeting. The meeting rooms down stairs were available but it was in full view of the general public and staff. So what . Have the people were dead they didn't say anything. At least the CEO in Carmarthenshire has stepped aside while investigations take place. Take note BPJ you are being investigated for the same offence.
Having listened to this debate I have never heard so much **** coming out of the mouth of the leader of the council, they used the BPJ office because the other rooms were being used by Hywel Dda for a meeting. The meeting rooms down stairs were available but it was in full view of the general public and staff. So what . Have the people were dead they didn't say anything. At least the CEO in Carmarthenshire has stepped aside while investigations take place. Take note BPJ you are being investigated for the same offence. Welshman23
  • Score: 42

6:52pm Fri 14 Feb 14

PCC Weasel says...

Well as they say, every cloud has a silver lining... following the precedent now set, surely in future ALL the IPPG members will have to be excluded from ALL future Council meetings as they ALWAYS meet beforehand to PREJUDGE the issues.... Bye bye Farmer Adams you are a disgrace!
Well as they say, every cloud has a silver lining... following the precedent now set, surely in future ALL the IPPG members will have to be excluded from ALL future Council meetings as they ALWAYS meet beforehand to PREJUDGE the issues.... Bye bye Farmer Adams you are a disgrace! PCC Weasel
  • Score: 50

6:55pm Fri 14 Feb 14

KeanJo says...

Extraordinary it was,-,extraordinaril
y farcical ,childish and undemocratic. We need the First Minister to take over the administration and arrange fresh elections as soon as possible .
Extraordinary it was,-,extraordinaril y farcical ,childish and undemocratic. We need the First Minister to take over the administration and arrange fresh elections as soon as possible . KeanJo
  • Score: 42

6:57pm Fri 14 Feb 14

garethjones123 says...

Well well well.... I watched this debacle this morning and believe the people of Pembrokeshire are being let down by a few of the councilors in privileged positions.... There were a number of of councilors who are true "servants" of the people who tried to demonstrate how corrupt and secretive these "privileged" few are....!!! Unfortunately with the use of "legal manipulation" they were denied the right to truly represent the people of Pembrokeshire's views and feelings........

What a disgrace for democracy......!!!!

"Carmarthenshire council chief steps down during police inquiry" headlines tonight's BBC article.... Surely the same thing should happen in Pembrokeshire....

Please help me..... What can we do to ensure that justice is done....!!!
Well well well.... I watched this debacle this morning and believe the people of Pembrokeshire are being let down by a few of the councilors in privileged positions.... There were a number of of councilors who are true "servants" of the people who tried to demonstrate how corrupt and secretive these "privileged" few are....!!! Unfortunately with the use of "legal manipulation" they were denied the right to truly represent the people of Pembrokeshire's views and feelings........ What a disgrace for democracy......!!!! "Carmarthenshire council chief steps down during police inquiry" headlines tonight's BBC article.... Surely the same thing should happen in Pembrokeshire.... Please help me..... What can we do to ensure that justice is done....!!! garethjones123
  • Score: 39

7:02pm Fri 14 Feb 14

quentin says...

Welshman23 wrote:
Having listened to this debate I have never heard so much **** coming out of the mouth of the leader of the council, they used the BPJ office because the other rooms were being used by Hywel Dda for a meeting. The meeting rooms down stairs were available but it was in full view of the general public and staff. So what . Have the people were dead they didn't say anything. At least the CEO in Carmarthenshire has stepped aside while investigations take place. Take note BPJ you are being investigated for the same offence.
At least the Carmarthenshire CEO has shown that he has some integrity in standing aside while the allegations are investigated. A quality sadly lacking down here it seems.
[quote][p][bold]Welshman23[/bold] wrote: Having listened to this debate I have never heard so much **** coming out of the mouth of the leader of the council, they used the BPJ office because the other rooms were being used by Hywel Dda for a meeting. The meeting rooms down stairs were available but it was in full view of the general public and staff. So what . Have the people were dead they didn't say anything. At least the CEO in Carmarthenshire has stepped aside while investigations take place. Take note BPJ you are being investigated for the same offence.[/p][/quote]At least the Carmarthenshire CEO has shown that he has some integrity in standing aside while the allegations are investigated. A quality sadly lacking down here it seems. quentin
  • Score: 32

7:15pm Fri 14 Feb 14

garethjones123 says...

When I saw this Extraordinary Meeting was being arranged, I thought wonderful, perhaps we will eventually get justice... But today confirmed that every silver lining has a cloud!!!!!
When I saw this Extraordinary Meeting was being arranged, I thought wonderful, perhaps we will eventually get justice... But today confirmed that every silver lining has a cloud!!!!! garethjones123
  • Score: 33

7:21pm Fri 14 Feb 14

Cymru bach says...

Now we know it seems we know why the QC was present at the meeting.

Council Leader Adams set great stall in the morning on saying that the chief Executive was not present out of respect for the Wales Audit office Report that had criticised his presence at the senior staff meeting.

But when it came to the crunch, the QC, (paid for by you and I) wax there to pull the rabbit out of the hat on his behalf.
Now we know it seems we know why the QC was present at the meeting. Council Leader Adams set great stall in the morning on saying that the chief Executive was not present out of respect for the Wales Audit office Report that had criticised his presence at the senior staff meeting. But when it came to the crunch, the QC, (paid for by you and I) wax there to pull the rabbit out of the hat on his behalf. Cymru bach
  • Score: 36

7:54pm Fri 14 Feb 14

patnurse says...

Yet again Bryn Parry Jones has shown his absolute arrogance, and disrespect for the people of Pembrokeshire!
Yet again Bryn Parry Jones has shown his absolute arrogance, and disrespect for the people of Pembrokeshire! patnurse
  • Score: 39

8:28pm Fri 14 Feb 14

Cymru bach says...

Following the decision in the first part of the meeting to discontinue the infamous pension arrangements, we can be sure that it will cost us (you and me) a small fortune to change the Pension arrangements (terms & conditions) of 'those affected by the decision' , and we all know who they are!
Following the decision in the first part of the meeting to discontinue the infamous pension arrangements, we can be sure that it will cost us (you and me) a small fortune to change the Pension arrangements (terms & conditions) of 'those affected by the decision' , and we all know who they are! Cymru bach
  • Score: 27

8:31pm Fri 14 Feb 14

Arthur Arran says...

Parry -Jones is playing hard, could I ask who pays for the QC? What I read in the local press this chap is an absolute shyster but he has survived. I'll bet anyone and I'll lay good odds against him getting ousted. He clearly hoodwinked (manipulated) the councillors who supported his pension bung. If he has broken the law, he's in breach of his terms of employment. Simple. I'd say to the Labour group, take him on and get rid if you've got the guts , if not shut up whingeing and take the beating. It looks to me like he's ahead on points
Parry -Jones is playing hard, could I ask who pays for the QC? What I read in the local press this chap is an absolute shyster but he has survived. I'll bet anyone and I'll lay good odds against him getting ousted. He clearly hoodwinked (manipulated) the councillors who supported his pension bung. If he has broken the law, he's in breach of his terms of employment. Simple. I'd say to the Labour group, take him on and get rid if you've got the guts , if not shut up whingeing and take the beating. It looks to me like he's ahead on points Arthur Arran
  • Score: 26

11:05pm Fri 14 Feb 14

pembrokedock123 says...

Disgraceful - appearing to put their hands up to having made "procedural errors" and having done wrong and then witholding the key legal advice from the council and also challenging the freedom of the press to cover councillors' views if they oppose the leadership's views. Astounding. Well done to the few councillors who stood up to the appalling attempted cover up by the bad guys. Not just kremlin but bunker.
Disgraceful - appearing to put their hands up to having made "procedural errors" and having done wrong and then witholding the key legal advice from the council and also challenging the freedom of the press to cover councillors' views if they oppose the leadership's views. Astounding. Well done to the few councillors who stood up to the appalling attempted cover up by the bad guys. Not just kremlin but bunker. pembrokedock123
  • Score: 24

11:06pm Fri 14 Feb 14

pembrokedock123 says...

it is also interesting to see that Jamie Adams' back expenses are being referred to the Wales Audit Office - I thought he was sitting with his back up against the wall in the webcast
it is also interesting to see that Jamie Adams' back expenses are being referred to the Wales Audit Office - I thought he was sitting with his back up against the wall in the webcast pembrokedock123
  • Score: 31

11:21pm Fri 14 Feb 14

Dawnchorus says...

BPJ and all of his cronies are looking out for themselves, not for the people of Pembrokeshire, so surely there must be a way to get rid of them. I mean Pembrokeshire isn't a dictatorship, is it??#*!^
The people struggle and the big-wigs line their own pockets, lawfully or unlawfully it's an absolute disgrace and everyone who's party to it should hang their heads in shame. But I doubt if any one of them feels anything other than contempt for us minions.
You will all be judged one day chaps, remember that......
BPJ and all of his cronies are looking out for themselves, not for the people of Pembrokeshire, so surely there must be a way to get rid of them. I mean Pembrokeshire isn't a dictatorship, is it??#*!^ The people struggle and the big-wigs line their own pockets, lawfully or unlawfully it's an absolute disgrace and everyone who's party to it should hang their heads in shame. But I doubt if any one of them feels anything other than contempt for us minions. You will all be judged one day chaps, remember that...... Dawnchorus
  • Score: 28

5:11am Sat 15 Feb 14

Flashbang says...

It could also be construed that the people who left the envelopes are blackmailing the recipients. Can we have the police investigating that too please.
How can an opinion on whether BPJ should be suspended when it has been clearly shown that payments made were illegal be a breach of a code of conduct.? How can not stepping down when caught out receiving illegal payments not also be a breach of the code of conduct?
It could also be construed that the people who left the envelopes are blackmailing the recipients. Can we have the police investigating that too please. How can an opinion on whether BPJ should be suspended when it has been clearly shown that payments made were illegal be a breach of a code of conduct.? How can not stepping down when caught out receiving illegal payments not also be a breach of the code of conduct? Flashbang
  • Score: 31

7:22am Sat 15 Feb 14

Arthur Arran says...

Since this episode has aroused the public passion could I suggest BPJ's employers (yes you, the duly elected councillors) take this all the way?, Stand up show some guts and do your duty, not his bidding. Don't stop and give him the opportunity to walk off with his pension and pay off intact. If he's broken the law it should be easy, in all known cases it would be, or is he above the law?
Since this episode has aroused the public passion could I suggest BPJ's employers (yes you, the duly elected councillors) take this all the way?, Stand up show some guts and do your duty, not his bidding. Don't stop and give him the opportunity to walk off with his pension and pay off intact. If he's broken the law it should be easy, in all known cases it would be, or is he above the law? Arthur Arran
  • Score: 24

7:29am Sat 15 Feb 14

Welshman23 says...

The QC had a list of councillors who had spoken to the WT and PEmbrokeshire Herald who supplied this information a mole in the papers.
The QC had a list of councillors who had spoken to the WT and PEmbrokeshire Herald who supplied this information a mole in the papers. Welshman23
  • Score: 9

7:35am Sat 15 Feb 14

Welshman23 says...

When will the name or names of the benefactors of this pension scheme be identified and are they being investigated by the police. Congrats to Dyfed Powys police for using an outside force to investigate, I hope this force digs deep enough to investigate everything including Adams 4 years expenses claim.
When will the name or names of the benefactors of this pension scheme be identified and are they being investigated by the police. Congrats to Dyfed Powys police for using an outside force to investigate, I hope this force digs deep enough to investigate everything including Adams 4 years expenses claim. Welshman23
  • Score: 27

8:02am Sat 15 Feb 14

Welshman23 says...

What side are our local MP'S on, they have made no comments, perhaps they will make comments after meeting with BJP.
What side are our local MP'S on, they have made no comments, perhaps they will make comments after meeting with BJP. Welshman23
  • Score: 22

8:24am Sat 15 Feb 14

South of the Landsker says...

Reading Welshman 23, I can confirm that it was the County Council 'independent' monitoring officer who provided the QC with the envelope when he was collected from Port Talbot railway station. The envelope contained a list of those Councillors who had made comments to the local press suggesting that Mr B P-J should be suspended. Those Councillors who voiced their support for him were not listed. This left only 5 opposition Councillors in the Council Chamber, it strikes me that an 'independent' monitoring officer should have suggested to members much earlier that they were in danger of breaking the code of conduct rather than passing brown envelopes to the QC in the back of a car. The QC was at the meeting to provide expert advice relating to the Wales Audit Office report and was invited to stay as part of the 'Sting Operation' to silence Councillors. Mr Stalin would have been so proud.
Reading Welshman 23, I can confirm that it was the County Council 'independent' monitoring officer who provided the QC with the envelope when he was collected from Port Talbot railway station. The envelope contained a list of those Councillors who had made comments to the local press suggesting that Mr B P-J should be suspended. Those Councillors who voiced their support for him were not listed. This left only 5 opposition Councillors in the Council Chamber, it strikes me that an 'independent' monitoring officer should have suggested to members much earlier that they were in danger of breaking the code of conduct rather than passing brown envelopes to the QC in the back of a car. The QC was at the meeting to provide expert advice relating to the Wales Audit Office report and was invited to stay as part of the 'Sting Operation' to silence Councillors. Mr Stalin would have been so proud. South of the Landsker
  • Score: 38

8:28am Sat 15 Feb 14

Moleinthegarden says...

Another shameful day in the history of Pembrokeshire CC but this time they have really messed up!
The ruling IPG cliques whilst elected by their constituents are not serving the people of Pembrokeshire they are just puppets of a system that is ruled by BPJ.

Last week Pembrokeshire were ranked number 1 for the highest paid Chief Exec in Wales
After yesterdays performance we will be the papers as the number 1 laughing stock of Wales..

Pembrokeshire Tax payers deserve better, we need honesty integrity at all times from the IPG Cabinet and the Chief officer but they have consistently failed.

There are other matters not resolved, such as the 4 year belated travel expenses claim from Jamie Adams, the miss use of Computers by Rob Lewis and other issues at Pembroke Dock with the grants. There is a deep running feeling that they are untouchable and enjoy protected status.

It's now time for WG to take over the authority as it is clear that the Authority at the highest levels is out of control.....
Another shameful day in the history of Pembrokeshire CC but this time they have really messed up! The ruling IPG cliques whilst elected by their constituents are not serving the people of Pembrokeshire they are just puppets of a system that is ruled by BPJ. Last week Pembrokeshire were ranked number 1 for the highest paid Chief Exec in Wales After yesterdays performance we will be the papers as the number 1 laughing stock of Wales.. Pembrokeshire Tax payers deserve better, we need honesty integrity at all times from the IPG Cabinet and the Chief officer but they have consistently failed. There are other matters not resolved, such as the 4 year belated travel expenses claim from Jamie Adams, the miss use of Computers by Rob Lewis and other issues at Pembroke Dock with the grants. There is a deep running feeling that they are untouchable and enjoy protected status. It's now time for WG to take over the authority as it is clear that the Authority at the highest levels is out of control..... Moleinthegarden
  • Score: 37

9:35am Sat 15 Feb 14

Welshman23 says...

South of the Landsker wrote:
Reading Welshman 23, I can confirm that it was the County Council 'independent' monitoring officer who provided the QC with the envelope when he was collected from Port Talbot railway station. The envelope contained a list of those Councillors who had made comments to the local press suggesting that Mr B P-J should be suspended. Those Councillors who voiced their support for him were not listed. This left only 5 opposition Councillors in the Council Chamber, it strikes me that an 'independent' monitoring officer should have suggested to members much earlier that they were in danger of breaking the code of conduct rather than passing brown envelopes to the QC in the back of a car. The QC was at the meeting to provide expert advice relating to the Wales Audit Office report and was invited to stay as part of the 'Sting Operation' to silence Councillors. Mr Stalin would have been so proud.
We collect the QC from the railway station in Port Talbot 1st class rail travel but not prepared to catch the train to Haverfordwest. What plonkers make these decisions to collect this person, they spend our money like water. The QC should be questioned these councillors made comments but ignored the people in favour of keeping BPJ. This makes me so angry 60 councillors at £14K ish per annum why do we need these people they are powerless pups, the people that fight our case are asked to leave Adams and your cronies do us all a favour resign NOWWWWWWWW....
[quote][p][bold]South of the Landsker[/bold] wrote: Reading Welshman 23, I can confirm that it was the County Council 'independent' monitoring officer who provided the QC with the envelope when he was collected from Port Talbot railway station. The envelope contained a list of those Councillors who had made comments to the local press suggesting that Mr B P-J should be suspended. Those Councillors who voiced their support for him were not listed. This left only 5 opposition Councillors in the Council Chamber, it strikes me that an 'independent' monitoring officer should have suggested to members much earlier that they were in danger of breaking the code of conduct rather than passing brown envelopes to the QC in the back of a car. The QC was at the meeting to provide expert advice relating to the Wales Audit Office report and was invited to stay as part of the 'Sting Operation' to silence Councillors. Mr Stalin would have been so proud.[/p][/quote]We collect the QC from the railway station in Port Talbot 1st class rail travel but not prepared to catch the train to Haverfordwest. What plonkers make these decisions to collect this person, they spend our money like water. The QC should be questioned these councillors made comments but ignored the people in favour of keeping BPJ. This makes me so angry 60 councillors at £14K ish per annum why do we need these people they are powerless pups, the people that fight our case are asked to leave Adams and your cronies do us all a favour resign NOWWWWWWWW.... Welshman23
  • Score: 30

9:37am Sat 15 Feb 14

Welshman23 says...

South of the Landsker wrote:
Reading Welshman 23, I can confirm that it was the County Council 'independent' monitoring officer who provided the QC with the envelope when he was collected from Port Talbot railway station. The envelope contained a list of those Councillors who had made comments to the local press suggesting that Mr B P-J should be suspended. Those Councillors who voiced their support for him were not listed. This left only 5 opposition Councillors in the Council Chamber, it strikes me that an 'independent' monitoring officer should have suggested to members much earlier that they were in danger of breaking the code of conduct rather than passing brown envelopes to the QC in the back of a car. The QC was at the meeting to provide expert advice relating to the Wales Audit Office report and was invited to stay as part of the 'Sting Operation' to silence Councillors. Mr Stalin would have been so proud.
That you South of the Landsker, you are in the know well done.
[quote][p][bold]South of the Landsker[/bold] wrote: Reading Welshman 23, I can confirm that it was the County Council 'independent' monitoring officer who provided the QC with the envelope when he was collected from Port Talbot railway station. The envelope contained a list of those Councillors who had made comments to the local press suggesting that Mr B P-J should be suspended. Those Councillors who voiced their support for him were not listed. This left only 5 opposition Councillors in the Council Chamber, it strikes me that an 'independent' monitoring officer should have suggested to members much earlier that they were in danger of breaking the code of conduct rather than passing brown envelopes to the QC in the back of a car. The QC was at the meeting to provide expert advice relating to the Wales Audit Office report and was invited to stay as part of the 'Sting Operation' to silence Councillors. Mr Stalin would have been so proud.[/p][/quote]That you South of the Landsker, you are in the know well done. Welshman23
  • Score: 16

9:51am Sat 15 Feb 14

DaiLarner says...

No longer in Pembs unfortunately but observing this debacle from afar - this is what the Localism Act in England says (does it not apply in Wales?)

"...the Government has used the Localism Act to clarify the rules on ‘predetermination
. These rules were developed to ensure that councillors came to council discussions - on, for example, planning applications - with an open mind. In practice, however, these rules had been interpreted in such a way as to reduce the quality of local debate and stifle valid discussion. In some cases councillors were warned off doing such things as campaigning, talking with constituents, or publicly expressing views on local issues, for fear of being accused of bias or facing legal challenge.

The Localism Act makes it clear that it is proper for councillors to play an active part in local discussions, and that they should not be liable to legal challenge as a result. This will help them better represent their constituents and enrich local democratic debate. People can elect their councillor confident in the knowledge that they will be able to act on the issues they care about and have campaigned on. "

QC knows the law better than me but it seems that the spirit if not the letter of the law has been breached here.
No longer in Pembs unfortunately but observing this debacle from afar - this is what the Localism Act in England says (does it not apply in Wales?) "...the Government has used the Localism Act to clarify the rules on ‘predetermination . These rules were developed to ensure that councillors came to council discussions - on, for example, planning applications - with an open mind. In practice, however, these rules had been interpreted in such a way as to reduce the quality of local debate and stifle valid discussion. In some cases councillors were warned off doing such things as campaigning, talking with constituents, or publicly expressing views on local issues, for fear of being accused of bias or facing legal challenge. The Localism Act makes it clear that it is proper for councillors to play an active part in local discussions, and that they should not be liable to legal challenge as a result. This will help them better represent their constituents and enrich local democratic debate. People can elect their councillor confident in the knowledge that they will be able to act on the issues they care about and have campaigned on. " QC knows the law better than me but it seems that the spirit if not the letter of the law has been breached here. DaiLarner
  • Score: 24

10:04am Sat 15 Feb 14

hardcheese says...

WALES ONLINE
QUOTE "Mark James, the chief executive of Carmarthenshire County Council, has agreed to step down from his job temporarily while police carry out an investigation following two Wales Office reports that say he received unlawful payments from the authority.

Meanwhile a full council meeting at Pembrokeshire County Council, where chief executive Bryn Parry-Jones also received payments deemed to have been unlawful, descended into chaos. Reports written by Anthony Barrett, the Assistant Auditor General for Wales, said the councils should not have allowed the two chief executives to receive “pay supplements” in lieu of employer’s pension contributions to avoid tax on their pensions. Carmarthenshire had also acted unlawfully by indemnifying a libel counter-claim brought by Mr James against blogger Jacqui Thompson."

It is now quite obvious that Bryn Parry-Jones has a load of support from some bent councillors...HE HAS GOT TO GO WITH HIS FRIENDS !!!!!
WALES ONLINE QUOTE "Mark James, the chief executive of Carmarthenshire County Council, has agreed to step down from his job temporarily while police carry out an investigation following two Wales Office reports that say he received unlawful payments from the authority. Meanwhile a full council meeting at Pembrokeshire County Council, where chief executive Bryn Parry-Jones also received payments deemed to have been unlawful, descended into chaos. Reports written by Anthony Barrett, the Assistant Auditor General for Wales, said the councils should not have allowed the two chief executives to receive “pay supplements” in lieu of employer’s pension contributions to avoid tax on their pensions. Carmarthenshire had also acted unlawfully by indemnifying a libel counter-claim brought by Mr James against blogger Jacqui Thompson." It is now quite obvious that Bryn Parry-Jones has a load of support from some bent councillors...HE HAS GOT TO GO WITH HIS FRIENDS !!!!! hardcheese
  • Score: 26

10:40am Sat 15 Feb 14

Theodore1 says...

The chancellor of the exchequer is always banging on about tax evasion, makes me wonder what is the attitude of H M Customs & Excise to this matter?
Have they noticed?
Is B P J guilty of anything at all?
Are the police pursuing real evidence?
These old boys in County Hall have always been masters of obfuscation, I hope they are paying out of their own pockets for their legal advice.
If this goes on long enough every one will get bored and go home - as usual. It seems Pembrokeshire is not sufficiently close to the Cardiff government to attract much attention!
The chancellor of the exchequer is always banging on about tax evasion, makes me wonder what is the attitude of H M Customs & Excise to this matter? Have they noticed? Is B P J guilty of anything at all? Are the police pursuing real evidence? These old boys in County Hall have always been masters of obfuscation, I hope they are paying out of their own pockets for their legal advice. If this goes on long enough every one will get bored and go home - as usual. It seems Pembrokeshire is not sufficiently close to the Cardiff government to attract much attention! Theodore1
  • Score: 19

10:46am Sat 15 Feb 14

Arthur Arran says...

I agree with a lot of the comments here but fear talking will do no good. Someone somewhere said "absolute power corrupts absolutely" I've already stated it's time to act. Prosecute those responsible and deny any pension rights or compensation whatsoever. Most mortals have to obey the rules or face the consequences.
I agree with a lot of the comments here but fear talking will do no good. Someone somewhere said "absolute power corrupts absolutely" I've already stated it's time to act. Prosecute those responsible and deny any pension rights or compensation whatsoever. Most mortals have to obey the rules or face the consequences. Arthur Arran
  • Score: 20

10:56am Sat 15 Feb 14

malcolm calver says...

Please remember all Pembrokeshire County Councillors stood for election in the normal manner and in most cases received the support of their electorate, therefore we get what we elect.
Why do we need to pay the salary of a Monitoring Offficer and then employ a QC to give us an opinion on the Code of Conduct. Councillors should ask when and who asked him for an opinion on the code of conduct., perhaps he was giving two opinions for the price of one. I thought his brief was to give an opinion on if the decision to reallocate pension fund payment was legal.
Please can someone provide the reasons each councillor gave for leaving the meeting as this has to be declared individually. This information would allow us to decide where each councillor stood on the issue.
Please remember all Pembrokeshire County Councillors stood for election in the normal manner and in most cases received the support of their electorate, therefore we get what we elect. Why do we need to pay the salary of a Monitoring Offficer and then employ a QC to give us an opinion on the Code of Conduct. Councillors should ask when and who asked him for an opinion on the code of conduct., perhaps he was giving two opinions for the price of one. I thought his brief was to give an opinion on if the decision to reallocate pension fund payment was legal. Please can someone provide the reasons each councillor gave for leaving the meeting as this has to be declared individually. This information would allow us to decide where each councillor stood on the issue. malcolm calver
  • Score: 21

11:06am Sat 15 Feb 14

pembrokedock123 says...

Malcolm Calver says "Why do we need to pay the salary of a Monitoring Offficer ". The Monitoring Officer's own Report to the council meeting says that he retired in 2011. Was he replaced? is there a full time Monitoring Officer now? Seems very odd.
Malcolm Calver says "Why do we need to pay the salary of a Monitoring Offficer ". The Monitoring Officer's own Report to the council meeting says that he retired in 2011. Was he replaced? is there a full time Monitoring Officer now? Seems very odd. pembrokedock123
  • Score: 12

11:08am Sat 15 Feb 14

Justiceforall says...

The Welsh office should move on this and sought this council and its fiasco out.
The Welsh office should move on this and sought this council and its fiasco out. Justiceforall
  • Score: 14

11:08am Sat 15 Feb 14

pembrokedock123 says...

Theodore says "It seems Pembrokeshire is not sufficiently close to the Cardiff government to attract much attention!" - yet Anglesey is even further away from Cardiff and they attracted attention - wasn't BPJ in Anglesey before Pembs?
Theodore says "It seems Pembrokeshire is not sufficiently close to the Cardiff government to attract much attention!" - yet Anglesey is even further away from Cardiff and they attracted attention - wasn't BPJ in Anglesey before Pembs? pembrokedock123
  • Score: 6

11:14am Sat 15 Feb 14

Mike Stoddart says...

Having been advised by a leading QC that we should declare an interest and leave the meeting, those of us who had expressed an opinion were in a difficult position.
Not only were we risking breaching the Code of Conduct, but there was also the possibility that any decision taken would be open to legal challenge because of our presence.
Had that come about there could have been a claim for compensation that might have cost the taxpayer an awful lot of money.
As it is, I am reliably informed that at the IPPG's secret group meeting held on Thursday evening, wavering members of the ruling party were warned that any attempt to dismiss Mr Parry-Jones would cost the council in the region of £1.25 million.
No pressure, then.
Having been advised by a leading QC that we should declare an interest and leave the meeting, those of us who had expressed an opinion were in a difficult position. Not only were we risking breaching the Code of Conduct, but there was also the possibility that any decision taken would be open to legal challenge because of our presence. Had that come about there could have been a claim for compensation that might have cost the taxpayer an awful lot of money. As it is, I am reliably informed that at the IPPG's secret group meeting held on Thursday evening, wavering members of the ruling party were warned that any attempt to dismiss Mr Parry-Jones would cost the council in the region of £1.25 million. No pressure, then. Mike Stoddart
  • Score: 23

11:15am Sat 15 Feb 14

pembrokedock123 says...

DaiLarner says " this is what the Localism Act in England says (does it not apply in Wales?)" I believe the Localism Act is only applicable in England - but that is not to say that Pembrokeshire's (silent so far) 5 Assembly Members could not raise this restriction of press freedom and right of elected members to say in public what their views are on such a crucial issue as the Council Chief Executive and one other still unnamed officer taking unlawful cash payments. Although how the standard of debate in Pembs Council could be reduced even further would be quite a challenge.
DaiLarner says " this is what the Localism Act in England says (does it not apply in Wales?)" I believe the Localism Act is only applicable in England - but that is not to say that Pembrokeshire's (silent so far) 5 Assembly Members could not raise this restriction of press freedom and right of elected members to say in public what their views are on such a crucial issue as the Council Chief Executive and one other still unnamed officer taking unlawful cash payments. Although how the standard of debate in Pembs Council could be reduced even further would be quite a challenge. pembrokedock123
  • Score: 14

11:53am Sat 15 Feb 14

SM1968 says...

I struggle with why it would cost £1.25 million to sack someone, if i was sacked for misconduct i would go with nothing. Personally i think the lot should go and put WAG in charge
I struggle with why it would cost £1.25 million to sack someone, if i was sacked for misconduct i would go with nothing. Personally i think the lot should go and put WAG in charge SM1968
  • Score: 19

12:05pm Sat 15 Feb 14

Indeview J Hudson says...

Having now junked its old pensions/tax scheme following consideration of an 8 page report by the Council's Monitoring officer and acceptance of the 4 specific recommendations in WAO report, the Council is free to re-introduce it following proper lawful administrative procedures, if it chooses to do so.

Payments made in this way will now have to be reversed

Why did the Council, (five senior officers and perhaps the Leader) on 29 November 2013 dispute the original findings of the WAO, at great and unnecessary cost for us taxpayers, for this all to end as it started in recognition that the Council had committed administrative errors rendering its decision making "contrary to law"? Wasn't this self evident to the Council's legal staff? Who were the beneficiaries of this course of action?

This result could have been achieved in negotiation. Who was/is responsible and how much has this affair cost us?

A letter ( Appendix 9) of the report, dated 7 February 2014 concerning the effects on the Dyfed Pensions scheme, shows that the Council was still trying to bolster its position ( and incurring more expenditure) at a late stage.

After two Judicial reviews, two external investigations into Childcare and Education, put into Special Measures, a fundamental Review of its Corporate Governance arrangements - still on-going;, police investigations into the CEO and THI Building works with still more unfavourable news to come out, when will somebody get a grip?
Having now junked its old pensions/tax scheme following consideration of an 8 page report by the Council's Monitoring officer and acceptance of the 4 specific recommendations in WAO report, the Council is free to re-introduce it following proper lawful administrative procedures, if it chooses to do so. Payments made in this way will now have to be reversed Why did the Council, (five senior officers and perhaps the Leader) on 29 November 2013 dispute the original findings of the WAO, at great and unnecessary cost for us taxpayers, for this all to end as it started in recognition that the Council had committed administrative errors rendering its decision making "contrary to law"? Wasn't this self evident to the Council's legal staff? Who were the beneficiaries of this course of action? This result could have been achieved in negotiation. Who was/is responsible and how much has this affair cost us? A letter ( Appendix 9) of the report, dated 7 February 2014 concerning the effects on the Dyfed Pensions scheme, shows that the Council was still trying to bolster its position ( and incurring more expenditure) at a late stage. After two Judicial reviews, two external investigations into Childcare and Education, put into Special Measures, a fundamental Review of its Corporate Governance arrangements - still on-going;, police investigations into the CEO and THI Building works with still more unfavourable news to come out, when will somebody get a grip? Indeview J Hudson
  • Score: 19

12:20pm Sat 15 Feb 14

Arthur Arran says...

I agree with SM1968. I've been saying that in my previous posts. Knowing councillor Stoddart like I do, I doubt he'd be intimidated by council big wigs. Presumably the person who relayed the information re £1.25 million, will have done the sums. The truth stands and always will, if BPJ has transgressed, he should go. No doubt he'll fight, who wouldn't with that kind of money at stake. I think he and his officers are bluffing, the whole episode stinks. Will the ratepayers be paying for this upcoming enquiry? .
I agree with SM1968. I've been saying that in my previous posts. Knowing councillor Stoddart like I do, I doubt he'd be intimidated by council big wigs. Presumably the person who relayed the information re £1.25 million, will have done the sums. The truth stands and always will, if BPJ has transgressed, he should go. No doubt he'll fight, who wouldn't with that kind of money at stake. I think he and his officers are bluffing, the whole episode stinks. Will the ratepayers be paying for this upcoming enquiry? . Arthur Arran
  • Score: 15

12:59pm Sat 15 Feb 14

Electra1 says...

pembrokedock123 wrote:
Theodore says "It seems Pembrokeshire is not sufficiently close to the Cardiff government to attract much attention!" - yet Anglesey is even further away from Cardiff and they attracted attention - wasn't BPJ in Anglesey before Pembs?
I thought he was in Llanelli.
[quote][p][bold]pembrokedock123[/bold] wrote: Theodore says "It seems Pembrokeshire is not sufficiently close to the Cardiff government to attract much attention!" - yet Anglesey is even further away from Cardiff and they attracted attention - wasn't BPJ in Anglesey before Pembs?[/p][/quote]I thought he was in Llanelli. Electra1
  • Score: 10

1:09pm Sat 15 Feb 14

Rockface says...

Having watched the episode myself I was left in shock and disbelief at the underhandedness of the Independent Monitoring Officer regarding the press cuttings handed over to Mr Kerr. I believe the IMO should stand down as this act of collusion, which led to the breakdown of the meeting, when he secretly provided biased information that was unbalanced. Surely he should have known that this would predetermine the outcome by removing the members who had moved the motion. It appeared to me to be a deliberate act of political sabotage. One could question the independence.

Another thing that was shocking was the private meeting with Mr Kerr which took place during the break. How stupid... it is obvious that Mr Kerr did not feel compromised by a previous 'potentially' unlawful act that took place in that very office in September 2011. This just illustrates how intellectually incompetent and unprincipled some elected members are, by putting those decisions in the hands of people who pay no price for being wrong and show complete disrespect for an open and transparent democratic process.
Having watched the episode myself I was left in shock and disbelief at the underhandedness of the Independent Monitoring Officer regarding the press cuttings handed over to Mr Kerr. I believe the IMO should stand down as this act of collusion, which led to the breakdown of the meeting, when he secretly provided biased information that was unbalanced. Surely he should have known that this would predetermine the outcome by removing the members who had moved the motion. It appeared to me to be a deliberate act of political sabotage. One could question the independence. Another thing that was shocking was the private meeting with Mr Kerr which took place during the break. How stupid... it is obvious that Mr Kerr did not feel compromised by a previous 'potentially' unlawful act that took place in that very office in September 2011. This just illustrates how intellectually incompetent and unprincipled some elected members are, by putting those decisions in the hands of people who pay no price for being wrong and show complete disrespect for an open and transparent democratic process. Rockface
  • Score: 21

1:22pm Sat 15 Feb 14

malcolm calver says...

So the differnce is Mike you can discuss it it a private party meeting with the leader trying to influence you and not discuss it in public meeting when the public can hear your views.
The next thing we will have is pre cabinet meetings.
So the differnce is Mike you can discuss it it a private party meeting with the leader trying to influence you and not discuss it in public meeting when the public can hear your views. The next thing we will have is pre cabinet meetings. malcolm calver
  • Score: 14

1:41pm Sat 15 Feb 14

Indeview J Hudson says...

OR member's only Seminars at which the Budget is discussed, thus avaiding any questions that may change the budget at Council in public.
OR member's only Seminars at which the Budget is discussed, thus avaiding any questions that may change the budget at Council in public. Indeview J Hudson
  • Score: 11

4:01pm Sat 15 Feb 14

Welshman23 says...

Mike Stoddart wrote:
Having been advised by a leading QC that we should declare an interest and leave the meeting, those of us who had expressed an opinion were in a difficult position.
Not only were we risking breaching the Code of Conduct, but there was also the possibility that any decision taken would be open to legal challenge because of our presence.
Had that come about there could have been a claim for compensation that might have cost the taxpayer an awful lot of money.
As it is, I am reliably informed that at the IPPG's secret group meeting held on Thursday evening, wavering members of the ruling party were warned that any attempt to dismiss Mr Parry-Jones would cost the council in the region of £1.25 million.
No pressure, then.
Why does it cost the authority this sort of money you do not reward people who brake the rules. He is not immune for investigation. Another point was the QC aware that the IPPG meeting was held the previous evening and where did it take place not in the Kremlin I hope. No one is asking to dismiss him but remove him from the post until the investigation is complete. If he is found guilty by the police it does not mean that he can be dismissed.
Mike did a vote take place on suspending BPJ, if not what is the process going forward another meeting.
[quote][p][bold]Mike Stoddart[/bold] wrote: Having been advised by a leading QC that we should declare an interest and leave the meeting, those of us who had expressed an opinion were in a difficult position. Not only were we risking breaching the Code of Conduct, but there was also the possibility that any decision taken would be open to legal challenge because of our presence. Had that come about there could have been a claim for compensation that might have cost the taxpayer an awful lot of money. As it is, I am reliably informed that at the IPPG's secret group meeting held on Thursday evening, wavering members of the ruling party were warned that any attempt to dismiss Mr Parry-Jones would cost the council in the region of £1.25 million. No pressure, then.[/p][/quote]Why does it cost the authority this sort of money you do not reward people who brake the rules. He is not immune for investigation. Another point was the QC aware that the IPPG meeting was held the previous evening and where did it take place not in the Kremlin I hope. No one is asking to dismiss him but remove him from the post until the investigation is complete. If he is found guilty by the police it does not mean that he can be dismissed. Mike did a vote take place on suspending BPJ, if not what is the process going forward another meeting. Welshman23
  • Score: 7

4:30pm Sat 15 Feb 14

teifion says...

Mike Stoddart wrote:
Having been advised by a leading QC that we should declare an interest and leave the meeting, those of us who had expressed an opinion were in a difficult position.
Not only were we risking breaching the Code of Conduct, but there was also the possibility that any decision taken would be open to legal challenge because of our presence.
Had that come about there could have been a claim for compensation that might have cost the taxpayer an awful lot of money.
As it is, I am reliably informed that at the IPPG's secret group meeting held on Thursday evening, wavering members of the ruling party were warned that any attempt to dismiss Mr Parry-Jones would cost the council in the region of £1.25 million.
No pressure, then.
Surely it's not going to cost 1.25 mill if he's sacked for illegality?
[quote][p][bold]Mike Stoddart[/bold] wrote: Having been advised by a leading QC that we should declare an interest and leave the meeting, those of us who had expressed an opinion were in a difficult position. Not only were we risking breaching the Code of Conduct, but there was also the possibility that any decision taken would be open to legal challenge because of our presence. Had that come about there could have been a claim for compensation that might have cost the taxpayer an awful lot of money. As it is, I am reliably informed that at the IPPG's secret group meeting held on Thursday evening, wavering members of the ruling party were warned that any attempt to dismiss Mr Parry-Jones would cost the council in the region of £1.25 million. No pressure, then.[/p][/quote]Surely it's not going to cost 1.25 mill if he's sacked for illegality? teifion
  • Score: 7

4:49pm Sat 15 Feb 14

quentin says...

This is all very sad because I'm sure it will mean the demise of Pembrokeshire as a separate authority. That may sound a pessimistic view but I can't see how we can survive this shambles. As someone above has said, we put these councillors in place so perhaps we aren't entirely blame free.
This is all very sad because I'm sure it will mean the demise of Pembrokeshire as a separate authority. That may sound a pessimistic view but I can't see how we can survive this shambles. As someone above has said, we put these councillors in place so perhaps we aren't entirely blame free. quentin
  • Score: 16

5:33pm Sat 15 Feb 14

Harrygrayballs says...

This farcical meeting and the downright disgusting tactics does us as a County no good whatsoever.
How long must this "charade"or is it travesty of local government
going to be allowed to continue??
Unfortunately I was unable to watch the webcast yesterday,does anyone know when it will be available online,as it was not earlier today??
This farcical meeting and the downright disgusting tactics does us as a County no good whatsoever. How long must this "charade"or is it travesty of local government going to be allowed to continue?? Unfortunately I was unable to watch the webcast yesterday,does anyone know when it will be available online,as it was not earlier today?? Harrygrayballs
  • Score: 16

6:57pm Sat 15 Feb 14

Dawnchorus says...

1.25 million to get rid of him!!!!
If it were you or I that had been receiving unlawful payments I'm sure we'd be looking at a prison term or a very hefty fine. However in PCC land, you can expect a 1.25 million pound pay-off for swindling thousands out of the tax payers. I never thought I'd say it, but this council should be put in to special measures and they should cut out all the dead-wood, self serving, arrogant, manipulative cheats and give this county back a council that we can be proud of.
1.25 million to get rid of him!!!! If it were you or I that had been receiving unlawful payments I'm sure we'd be looking at a prison term or a very hefty fine. However in PCC land, you can expect a 1.25 million pound pay-off for swindling thousands out of the tax payers. I never thought I'd say it, but this council should be put in to special measures and they should cut out all the dead-wood, self serving, arrogant, manipulative cheats and give this county back a council that we can be proud of. Dawnchorus
  • Score: 18

8:02pm Sat 15 Feb 14

KeanJo says...

It was half an hoist before I realised the fellow with the beard was not chairing the meeting. The only person on the front bench who came out of the meeting with any credit was the Auditor - you know the fellow Jamie Owens accused of not knowing the law. The whole costly farce is enough to make you weep.
It was half an hoist before I realised the fellow with the beard was not chairing the meeting. The only person on the front bench who came out of the meeting with any credit was the Auditor - you know the fellow Jamie Owens accused of not knowing the law. The whole costly farce is enough to make you weep. KeanJo
  • Score: 17

8:09pm Sat 15 Feb 14

Gogledd says...

A couple of people have said where is Stephen Crabb in all this, what is he doing about it. Well, to be honest, he cant, this is a Welsh Government issue and there is little he can do. Another thing worth considering is why is it that we dont seem to be able to attract the right people to the job. I seem to remember somewhere in this meeting that it was mentioned that we were paying this rediculous sum and sums of money to people to get the right ppl into the job...and that once offered the job they were turning it down...how odd!!..we might need to ask our selves why is it ppl dont want to live and work here? has it got anything to do with our abismal Education system and the fact that our local hospital is about to reduce its Anti Natal services?...we should also be thinking about these things and what can we do to address this very serious issue. We already know that there is a missing generation in Pembrokeshire as our young hopefulls leave and obviously cant return...a very sad situation.
A couple of people have said where is Stephen Crabb in all this, what is he doing about it. Well, to be honest, he cant, this is a Welsh Government issue and there is little he can do. Another thing worth considering is why is it that we dont seem to be able to attract the right people to the job. I seem to remember somewhere in this meeting that it was mentioned that we were paying this rediculous sum and sums of money to people to get the right ppl into the job...and that once offered the job they were turning it down...how odd!!..we might need to ask our selves why is it ppl dont want to live and work here? has it got anything to do with our abismal Education system and the fact that our local hospital is about to reduce its Anti Natal services?...we should also be thinking about these things and what can we do to address this very serious issue. We already know that there is a missing generation in Pembrokeshire as our young hopefulls leave and obviously cant return...a very sad situation. Gogledd
  • Score: 7

9:46pm Sat 15 Feb 14

ScoobyDooby says...

Welshman23 wrote:
The QC had a list of councillors who had spoken to the WT and PEmbrokeshire Herald who supplied this information a mole in the papers.
As their comments were published in the papers, he wouldn't need a mole, just Lawrence Harding and a pair of scissors
[quote][p][bold]Welshman23[/bold] wrote: The QC had a list of councillors who had spoken to the WT and PEmbrokeshire Herald who supplied this information a mole in the papers.[/p][/quote]As their comments were published in the papers, he wouldn't need a mole, just Lawrence Harding and a pair of scissors ScoobyDooby
  • Score: 8

9:52pm Sat 15 Feb 14

Gogledd says...

Harrygrayballs wrote:
This farcical meeting and the downright disgusting tactics does us as a County no good whatsoever.
How long must this "charade"or is it travesty of local government
going to be allowed to continue??
Unfortunately I was unable to watch the webcast yesterday,does anyone know when it will be available online,as it was not earlier today??
No I dont...they are most probably busy editing it. It was an education to watch it live, I think I have said if it wasnt so desperately serious it would have been funny. It was frankly quite un believable and in fact frightening because it made u realise what sort of people u are up against. I did write to the WG about this issue months ago and the reply I got was one of basically, we are aware and are going to do nothing!!.
[quote][p][bold]Harrygrayballs[/bold] wrote: This farcical meeting and the downright disgusting tactics does us as a County no good whatsoever. How long must this "charade"or is it travesty of local government going to be allowed to continue?? Unfortunately I was unable to watch the webcast yesterday,does anyone know when it will be available online,as it was not earlier today??[/p][/quote]No I dont...they are most probably busy editing it. It was an education to watch it live, I think I have said if it wasnt so desperately serious it would have been funny. It was frankly quite un believable and in fact frightening because it made u realise what sort of people u are up against. I did write to the WG about this issue months ago and the reply I got was one of basically, we are aware and are going to do nothing!!. Gogledd
  • Score: 10

11:41pm Sat 15 Feb 14

Welshman23 says...

The councillors who discussed the possible suspension of BPJ with the press will now understand that the made a big mistake and as a result this problem goes on and on. It further suggests that the envelope with the details of the people had had discussions with the press were possibly set up by the papers because the WT could not careless about the truth. Now the national press should get involved these papers dig and dig until they find something.
The councillors who discussed the possible suspension of BPJ with the press will now understand that the made a big mistake and as a result this problem goes on and on. It further suggests that the envelope with the details of the people had had discussions with the press were possibly set up by the papers because the WT could not careless about the truth. Now the national press should get involved these papers dig and dig until they find something. Welshman23
  • Score: 7

9:15am Sun 16 Feb 14

Indeview J Hudson says...

After the meeting was adjourned, I think so that The Leader could consult with his (our) QC (Web-cast not up for viewing yet!), a member commented that the Deputy Chief Executive had called certain people to the Chief Executive's Office. Who were these people and why?
Did a councillor suggested that all councillors could leave the Chamber, leaving the Leader and QC to carry on the meeting in public.

How kind of the Council's impartial Monitoring Officer and guardian of ethics, to be concerned for members compliance with the Code of conduct rules on pre-determination and pre-disposition to ask the QC to advise on whether members comments, as reported in newspapers, amounted to possible grounds for legal challenge, if they took part in the debate and decision. How did he know what was in their minds?
When the IPG had its pre-meeting, were all the arguments for and against suspension considered and a decision made before the Council meeting? Did this amount to pre-determination or pre- disposition, and were they all disqualified from voting?
In the end it doesn't matter because the Pembrokeshire electorate were denied a public debate on the matter.
How many councillors, despite what they may or may not have said outside, or view taken at political group pre- meetings, went into that meeting with closed minds as to how they would vote?
Are we now not allowed to discuss matters and know the views of our councillors at all?
After the meeting was adjourned, I think so that The Leader could consult with his (our) QC (Web-cast not up for viewing yet!), a member commented that the Deputy Chief Executive had called certain people to the Chief Executive's Office. Who were these people and why? Did a councillor suggested that all councillors could leave the Chamber, leaving the Leader and QC to carry on the meeting in public. How kind of the Council's impartial Monitoring Officer and guardian of ethics, to be concerned for members compliance with the Code of conduct rules on pre-determination and pre-disposition to ask the QC to advise on whether members comments, as reported in newspapers, amounted to possible grounds for legal challenge, if they took part in the debate and decision. How did he know what was in their minds? When the IPG had its pre-meeting, were all the arguments for and against suspension considered and a decision made before the Council meeting? Did this amount to pre-determination or pre- disposition, and were they all disqualified from voting? In the end it doesn't matter because the Pembrokeshire electorate were denied a public debate on the matter. How many councillors, despite what they may or may not have said outside, or view taken at political group pre- meetings, went into that meeting with closed minds as to how they would vote? Are we now not allowed to discuss matters and know the views of our councillors at all? Indeview J Hudson
  • Score: 19

9:35am Sun 16 Feb 14

Arthur Arran says...

Why isn't there a comment here from our elected representatives? Mike Stoddart apart. Our Neyland councillors Miller and Hancock don't seem to be contributing to the debate. Are they afraid? or perhaps they feel they owe loyalty to BPJ rather than the public. I know Paul Miller has been at the heart of this campaign, still a few words here might enlighten us. Simon Hancock seems absent from the debate, it would be interesting to hear his opinion on this.
Why isn't there a comment here from our elected representatives? Mike Stoddart apart. Our Neyland councillors Miller and Hancock don't seem to be contributing to the debate. Are they afraid? or perhaps they feel they owe loyalty to BPJ rather than the public. I know Paul Miller has been at the heart of this campaign, still a few words here might enlighten us. Simon Hancock seems absent from the debate, it would be interesting to hear his opinion on this. Arthur Arran
  • Score: 13

10:43am Sun 16 Feb 14

Indeview J Hudson says...

All political debate, and exchange of views outside the Council Chamber has now been successfully muffled by the Council on legal advice..
IF councillor expresses a view on any matter that they are to play a part in deciding, it may regarded as a breach of the Code of Conduct and they could face suspension!
Isn't democracy wonderful.
All political debate, and exchange of views outside the Council Chamber has now been successfully muffled by the Council on legal advice.. IF councillor expresses a view on any matter that they are to play a part in deciding, it may regarded as a breach of the Code of Conduct and they could face suspension! Isn't democracy wonderful. Indeview J Hudson
  • Score: 13

11:16am Sun 16 Feb 14

Justiceforall says...

IPPG's secret group meeting held on Thursday evening, wavering members of the ruling party were warned that any attempt to dismiss Mr Parry-Jones would cost the council in the region of £1.25 million.

If anything illegal has occured, surely there should be a number of sackings without any pay offs.
IPPG's secret group meeting held on Thursday evening, wavering members of the ruling party were warned that any attempt to dismiss Mr Parry-Jones would cost the council in the region of £1.25 million. If anything illegal has occured, surely there should be a number of sackings without any pay offs. Justiceforall
  • Score: 12

11:24am Sun 16 Feb 14

Flashbang says...

Justiceforall wrote:
IPPG's secret group meeting held on Thursday evening, wavering members of the ruling party were warned that any attempt to dismiss Mr Parry-Jones would cost the council in the region of £1.25 million.

If anything illegal has occured, surely there should be a number of sackings without any pay offs.
None of these people should be allowed to hold public office, now and in the future.
[quote][p][bold]Justiceforall[/bold] wrote: IPPG's secret group meeting held on Thursday evening, wavering members of the ruling party were warned that any attempt to dismiss Mr Parry-Jones would cost the council in the region of £1.25 million. If anything illegal has occured, surely there should be a number of sackings without any pay offs.[/p][/quote]None of these people should be allowed to hold public office, now and in the future. Flashbang
  • Score: 13

12:58pm Sun 16 Feb 14

Welshman23 says...

Arthur Arran wrote:
Why isn't there a comment here from our elected representatives? Mike Stoddart apart. Our Neyland councillors Miller and Hancock don't seem to be contributing to the debate. Are they afraid? or perhaps they feel they owe loyalty to BPJ rather than the public. I know Paul Miller has been at the heart of this campaign, still a few words here might enlighten us. Simon Hancock seems absent from the debate, it would be interesting to hear his opinion on this.
Arthur comments are correct I suppose after Friday's fiasco the councillors are frightened off by the fall out they are puppets not even the Labour,Conservative and other members of the council have expressed their opinions. Even our local waste of time MP'S have made any constructive input into the going ons at the Kremlin. BPJ and his supporters are winning on points as there was no vote and he is still in work, despite a police investigation.
[quote][p][bold]Arthur Arran[/bold] wrote: Why isn't there a comment here from our elected representatives? Mike Stoddart apart. Our Neyland councillors Miller and Hancock don't seem to be contributing to the debate. Are they afraid? or perhaps they feel they owe loyalty to BPJ rather than the public. I know Paul Miller has been at the heart of this campaign, still a few words here might enlighten us. Simon Hancock seems absent from the debate, it would be interesting to hear his opinion on this.[/p][/quote]Arthur comments are correct I suppose after Friday's fiasco the councillors are frightened off by the fall out they are puppets not even the Labour,Conservative and other members of the council have expressed their opinions. Even our local waste of time MP'S have made any constructive input into the going ons at the Kremlin. BPJ and his supporters are winning on points as there was no vote and he is still in work, despite a police investigation. Welshman23
  • Score: 7

1:28pm Sun 16 Feb 14

Indeview J Hudson says...

It would be helpful if the WT could put the comments made by councillors up on the web-site so that we could see what they were and why they had to leave a Council meeting..
It would be helpful if the WT could put the comments made by councillors up on the web-site so that we could see what they were and why they had to leave a Council meeting.. Indeview J Hudson
  • Score: 13

1:45pm Sun 16 Feb 14

princes gate says...

freemasonry rules again
freemasonry rules again princes gate
  • Score: 11

1:48pm Sun 16 Feb 14

Martin Lewis says...

Arthur Arran wrote:
Why isn't there a comment here from our elected representatives? Mike Stoddart apart. Our Neyland councillors Miller and Hancock don't seem to be contributing to the debate. Are they afraid? or perhaps they feel they owe loyalty to BPJ rather than the public. I know Paul Miller has been at the heart of this campaign, still a few words here might enlighten us. Simon Hancock seems absent from the debate, it would be interesting to hear his opinion on this.
Arthur

I've spoken to both Paul Miller & Simon Hancock. Paul obviously has been the instigator of this issue and is a very potent opposition councillor. Simon Hancock on the other hand has shown his true colours after the last election and let down the people of Neyland very badly in my opinion. No matter what the ins and outs of it all the facts are that he was elected as a Labour councillor, he jumped ship to Jamie Adams' "Independent Plus Group" (which was renamed so that he didn't have to break his promise of never joining the "Independent Political Group) and was promoted immediately to a cabinet post with the accompanying Special Responsibility Allowance of circa £7,000 I believe, a post that he most certainly would NOT have been given had he remained a member of the Labour group, or indeed a non-affiliated dictionary definition Independent which in my opinion he should have done if he felt compelled to resign from the Labour group. This is the type of person that Jamie Adams has recruited. Yes men who sit alongside him on the benches and allow disgraceful scenes such as we're witnessed on Friday. There are too many apathetic people in the county who have no interest in local politics and do not challenge their representatives on an ongoing basis once elected. I certainly did and I will continue to do so. The Adams Family may think they did really well on Friday but never before have we been able to witness first hand the personalities of these people in debate without taking the effort to trek down to County Hall. Brian "I've only got 4 lines left" Hall continues to be a laughing stock, having the gall to accuse people of bullying tactics LOL.

The behaviour of the Impartial Monitoring Officer was reprehensible. She Perkins.....how can anyone possibly take her seriously? Likewise Ken Rowlands and John Allen-Mirehouse. Thank goodness for the likes of Stoddart, Miller, Williams, Mike Evans etc. I watched the meeting online from home in Neyland and I could smell the stench of bullish!t from 6 miles away.
[quote][p][bold]Arthur Arran[/bold] wrote: Why isn't there a comment here from our elected representatives? Mike Stoddart apart. Our Neyland councillors Miller and Hancock don't seem to be contributing to the debate. Are they afraid? or perhaps they feel they owe loyalty to BPJ rather than the public. I know Paul Miller has been at the heart of this campaign, still a few words here might enlighten us. Simon Hancock seems absent from the debate, it would be interesting to hear his opinion on this.[/p][/quote]Arthur I've spoken to both Paul Miller & Simon Hancock. Paul obviously has been the instigator of this issue and is a very potent opposition councillor. Simon Hancock on the other hand has shown his true colours after the last election and let down the people of Neyland very badly in my opinion. No matter what the ins and outs of it all the facts are that he was elected as a Labour councillor, he jumped ship to Jamie Adams' "Independent Plus Group" (which was renamed so that he didn't have to break his promise of never joining the "Independent Political Group) and was promoted immediately to a cabinet post with the accompanying Special Responsibility Allowance of circa £7,000 I believe, a post that he most certainly would NOT have been given had he remained a member of the Labour group, or indeed a non-affiliated dictionary definition Independent which in my opinion he should have done if he felt compelled to resign from the Labour group. This is the type of person that Jamie Adams has recruited. Yes men who sit alongside him on the benches and allow disgraceful scenes such as we're witnessed on Friday. There are too many apathetic people in the county who have no interest in local politics and do not challenge their representatives on an ongoing basis once elected. I certainly did and I will continue to do so. The Adams Family may think they did really well on Friday but never before have we been able to witness first hand the personalities of these people in debate without taking the effort to trek down to County Hall. Brian "I've only got 4 lines left" Hall continues to be a laughing stock, having the gall to accuse people of bullying tactics LOL. The behaviour of the Impartial Monitoring Officer was reprehensible. She Perkins.....how can anyone possibly take her seriously? Likewise Ken Rowlands and John Allen-Mirehouse. Thank goodness for the likes of Stoddart, Miller, Williams, Mike Evans etc. I watched the meeting online from home in Neyland and I could smell the stench of bullish!t from 6 miles away. Martin Lewis
  • Score: 17

1:51pm Sun 16 Feb 14

Martin Lewis says...

*Sue Perkins
*Sue Perkins Martin Lewis
  • Score: 4

1:58pm Sun 16 Feb 14

Martin Lewis says...

Oh and a vote of thanks to the councillor who motioned the trial of online webcasts of council meetings, David Howlett I believe. What odds that once the trial period had expired the IPG block vote will determine some reason not to continue it.
Oh and a vote of thanks to the councillor who motioned the trial of online webcasts of council meetings, David Howlett I believe. What odds that once the trial period had expired the IPG block vote will determine some reason not to continue it. Martin Lewis
  • Score: 15

3:21pm Sun 16 Feb 14

Jonathan Nutting says...

I think things are serious enough that the majority of opposition councillors are keeping our powder dry. There is a steely determination that enough is enough.

I hope some of you have/will actually contacted your local councillor . Direct action at this moment is appropriate. All contact information can be found on the PCC website under county councillors. My information is there and I am happy to listen to the views of the people I represent. It adds strength to my arguments.

I am extremely sad at how poorly we are working for the people of Pembrokeshire. Unfortunately we are all tarred by the same brush. At this moment I feel sick at what is happening and has happened. Those who care I can assure you all , are similarly distressed. There are a large group of us who do care. It is up to you all to remind those who have let us all down where their priorities lie. They were voted into serve Pembrokeshire..... DO IT!!!!

Please remember a large number of our senior officers are professional and hard working. All workers for the council are not to blame for the fiasco that continues to unfold. They deserve your support. Moral is low. PCC has much to be proud of. Many areas are examplers of good practice. Our education department has improved dramatically.

It will get better.
I think things are serious enough that the majority of opposition councillors are keeping our powder dry. There is a steely determination that enough is enough. I hope some of you have/will actually contacted your local councillor . Direct action at this moment is appropriate. All contact information can be found on the PCC website under county councillors. My information is there and I am happy to listen to the views of the people I represent. It adds strength to my arguments. I am extremely sad at how poorly we are working for the people of Pembrokeshire. Unfortunately we are all tarred by the same brush. At this moment I feel sick at what is happening and has happened. Those who care I can assure you all , are similarly distressed. There are a large group of us who do care. It is up to you all to remind those who have let us all down where their priorities lie. They were voted into serve Pembrokeshire..... DO IT!!!! Please remember a large number of our senior officers are professional and hard working. All workers for the council are not to blame for the fiasco that continues to unfold. They deserve your support. Moral is low. PCC has much to be proud of. Many areas are examplers of good practice. Our education department has improved dramatically. It will get better. Jonathan Nutting
  • Score: 10

3:31pm Sun 16 Feb 14

Jonathan Nutting says...

John I think you will find that Mr. Kerr was only given the Pembrokehire Herald interviews. For some reason he was not given the Western Telegraph comments. It was due to his inability to judge my contribution that forced me to withdraw.
John I think you will find that Mr. Kerr was only given the Pembrokehire Herald interviews. For some reason he was not given the Western Telegraph comments. It was due to his inability to judge my contribution that forced me to withdraw. Jonathan Nutting
  • Score: 9

4:08pm Sun 16 Feb 14

Indeview J Hudson says...

The Notice of Motion was to suspend leading to an investigation, this is a lawful step in the statutory procedure to dismiss a chief officer, ( by the way this term embraces the CEO, CFO, Monitoring officer and I think Head of Legal services).
Whoever floated the idea that it would cost £1.25m on dismissal to the IPG members at a pre-meeting, must by implication pre-judged the likely outcome of an investigation
Was this a relevant consideration?
So much for pre-determination or predisposition.

Given the track record of this Council over recent years, can anybody reasonably consider that not even an investigation was warranted?.

I would like to hear the reason(s) why not.
The Notice of Motion was to suspend leading to an investigation, this is a lawful step in the statutory procedure to dismiss a chief officer, ( by the way this term embraces the CEO, CFO, Monitoring officer and I think Head of Legal services). Whoever floated the idea that it would cost £1.25m on dismissal to the IPG members at a pre-meeting, must by implication pre-judged the likely outcome of an investigation Was this a relevant consideration? So much for pre-determination or predisposition. Given the track record of this Council over recent years, can anybody reasonably consider that not even an investigation was warranted?. I would like to hear the reason(s) why not. Indeview J Hudson
  • Score: 12

6:14pm Sun 16 Feb 14

SM1968 says...

"Dictators ride to and fro on tigers which they dare not dismount, and the tigers are getting hungry" ... Winston Churchill
"Dictators ride to and fro on tigers which they dare not dismount, and the tigers are getting hungry" ... Winston Churchill SM1968
  • Score: 11

7:07pm Sun 16 Feb 14

teifion says...

princes gate wrote:
freemasonry rules again
I was taught to be cautious but honestly Freemasonry SHOULD be there to help the poor and the needy NOT small scale corruption to help your freemason friends in the local coven
[quote][p][bold]princes gate[/bold] wrote: freemasonry rules again[/p][/quote]I was taught to be cautious but honestly Freemasonry SHOULD be there to help the poor and the needy NOT small scale corruption to help your freemason friends in the local coven teifion
  • Score: 14

8:24pm Sun 16 Feb 14

Mike Stoddart says...

Martin Lewis,
I agree absolutely with almost everything you say.
However, there is one inaccuracy in your comment: the SRA for cabinet members is £15,000 not £7,000.
And it should also be noted that, as a result of his membership of the ruling clique, Cllr Hancock has recently been appointed as local authority representative on the Hywel Dda Health Board - salary £13,000.
So, if you include his £13,000 basic allowance as a councillor, he is trousering in excess of £40,000 of the taxpayers money.
What price party loyalty when set against that?
Martin Lewis, I agree absolutely with almost everything you say. However, there is one inaccuracy in your comment: the SRA for cabinet members is £15,000 not £7,000. And it should also be noted that, as a result of his membership of the ruling clique, Cllr Hancock has recently been appointed as local authority representative on the Hywel Dda Health Board - salary £13,000. So, if you include his £13,000 basic allowance as a councillor, he is trousering in excess of £40,000 of the taxpayers money. What price party loyalty when set against that? Mike Stoddart
  • Score: 21

9:15pm Sun 16 Feb 14

danthomas says...

Mike - £40k!!
I'm absolutely gobsmacked and I'm sure others will be
No wonder they're so keen to tow the party line
Mike - £40k!! I'm absolutely gobsmacked and I'm sure others will be No wonder they're so keen to tow the party line danthomas
  • Score: 16

9:38pm Sun 16 Feb 14

Martin Lewis says...

Mike Stoddart wrote:
Martin Lewis,
I agree absolutely with almost everything you say.
However, there is one inaccuracy in your comment: the SRA for cabinet members is £15,000 not £7,000.
And it should also be noted that, as a result of his membership of the ruling clique, Cllr Hancock has recently been appointed as local authority representative on the Hywel Dda Health Board - salary £13,000.
So, if you include his £13,000 basic allowance as a councillor, he is trousering in excess of £40,000 of the taxpayers money.
What price party loyalty when set against that?
I wasn't sure about the amounts Mike. I thought the councillors allowance was about 14-15k and the SRAs 7-8k. The confusion is your fault as you hardly ever mention SRAs on your blog :-) Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't Simon Hancock's appointment to the Health Board independent of PCC as candidates were selected from all areas of Hywel Dda? I still fail to understand how any councillor can accept 3,4 or however many SRAs for additional duties when they're already remunerated for being full time councillors, I thought that was the whole idea I a councillors allowance. They're supposed to be in it for community service reasons not the unwarranted additional allowances.
[quote][p][bold]Mike Stoddart[/bold] wrote: Martin Lewis, I agree absolutely with almost everything you say. However, there is one inaccuracy in your comment: the SRA for cabinet members is £15,000 not £7,000. And it should also be noted that, as a result of his membership of the ruling clique, Cllr Hancock has recently been appointed as local authority representative on the Hywel Dda Health Board - salary £13,000. So, if you include his £13,000 basic allowance as a councillor, he is trousering in excess of £40,000 of the taxpayers money. What price party loyalty when set against that?[/p][/quote]I wasn't sure about the amounts Mike. I thought the councillors allowance was about 14-15k and the SRAs 7-8k. The confusion is your fault as you hardly ever mention SRAs on your blog :-) Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't Simon Hancock's appointment to the Health Board independent of PCC as candidates were selected from all areas of Hywel Dda? I still fail to understand how any councillor can accept 3,4 or however many SRAs for additional duties when they're already remunerated for being full time councillors, I thought that was the whole idea I a councillors allowance. They're supposed to be in it for community service reasons not the unwarranted additional allowances. Martin Lewis
  • Score: 14

9:39pm Sun 16 Feb 14

Martin Lewis says...

Apologies for the typos, bloody iPhone autocorrect.
Apologies for the typos, bloody iPhone autocorrect. Martin Lewis
  • Score: 3

9:50pm Sun 16 Feb 14

pembrokedock123 says...

well done to Mike Stoddart and the others who are standing up to some very nasty behaviour - it must be exhausting and galling when you know right is not winning over might - but BPJ et al have not been exposed so much before, they are really in the ropes now, they have rescinded the policy if not the actual pay and if you can bear to keep going and continue to get as much in the light of day as possible then Pembrokeshire and democracy will be the better for it - many thanks for what you are doing
well done to Mike Stoddart and the others who are standing up to some very nasty behaviour - it must be exhausting and galling when you know right is not winning over might - but BPJ et al have not been exposed so much before, they are really in the ropes now, they have rescinded the policy if not the actual pay and if you can bear to keep going and continue to get as much in the light of day as possible then Pembrokeshire and democracy will be the better for it - many thanks for what you are doing pembrokedock123
  • Score: 17

12:49am Mon 17 Feb 14

North of the Landsker says...

Welcome to the Democratic People's Republic of Pembrokeshire. Think of it as an off-shoot of North Korea.

In charge is supremo, Bryn Jong-un, but he was unable to make it to the extraordinary meeting so was replaced by Tim Jong-un.
Welcome to the Democratic People's Republic of Pembrokeshire. Think of it as an off-shoot of North Korea. In charge is supremo, Bryn Jong-un, but he was unable to make it to the extraordinary meeting so was replaced by Tim Jong-un. North of the Landsker
  • Score: 14

10:43am Mon 17 Feb 14

KeanJo says...

This law on prejudgment is a nonsense. I think most of us prejudge matters from information which has been made available to us but we would be prepared to listen to a reasoned debate and change our minds if the counter arguments were convincing enough. There is no doubt that the people who were advised to leave should have stayed in the Chamber and allowed to listen to the other side's point of view.
'
This law on prejudgment is a nonsense. I think most of us prejudge matters from information which has been made available to us but we would be prepared to listen to a reasoned debate and change our minds if the counter arguments were convincing enough. There is no doubt that the people who were advised to leave should have stayed in the Chamber and allowed to listen to the other side's point of view. ' KeanJo
  • Score: 11

11:17am Mon 17 Feb 14

pembrokedock123 says...

The webcast is available at http://www.pembrokes
hire.public-i.tv/cor
e/portal/webcast_int
eractive/128004

not fitting for viewing by those of delicate disposition or believers in democracy who are easily rattled
The webcast is available at http://www.pembrokes hire.public-i.tv/cor e/portal/webcast_int eractive/128004 not fitting for viewing by those of delicate disposition or believers in democracy who are easily rattled pembrokedock123
  • Score: 11

12:11pm Mon 17 Feb 14

seaveiw says...

PLEASE get the welsh assembly to take over and run this corrupt and undemocratic county council, they are already proven incapable of running education and child protection. The sooner the reorganisation takes place the better.
PLEASE get the welsh assembly to take over and run this corrupt and undemocratic county council, they are already proven incapable of running education and child protection. The sooner the reorganisation takes place the better. seaveiw
  • Score: 14

5:14pm Mon 17 Feb 14

Citizen Pembs says...

Missing from the scene last Friday in the Ministry of Truth was Big Brother on a telescreen. The invisible man.

Squealer Adams tried to convince us all that

Freedom is Slavery

Ignorance is Strength

All animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others

You couldn't make it up

Oh yes. George Orwell did!
Missing from the scene last Friday in the Ministry of Truth was Big Brother on a telescreen. The invisible man. Squealer Adams tried to convince us all that Freedom is Slavery Ignorance is Strength All animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others You couldn't make it up Oh yes. George Orwell did! Citizen Pembs
  • Score: 10

5:25pm Mon 17 Feb 14

KeanJo says...

The rent a crowd minuses have been at it again. They are a sorry lot.
The rent a crowd minuses have been at it again. They are a sorry lot. KeanJo
  • Score: -2

10:46pm Mon 17 Feb 14

teifion says...

KeanJo wrote:
The rent a crowd minuses have been at it again. They are a sorry lot.
But at least the scum know how much the ppl of Pembs despise them and their whole family - hope it offsets the pleasure they get from their wallets being added to
[quote][p][bold]KeanJo[/bold] wrote: The rent a crowd minuses have been at it again. They are a sorry lot.[/p][/quote]But at least the scum know how much the ppl of Pembs despise them and their whole family - hope it offsets the pleasure they get from their wallets being added to teifion
  • Score: 5

8:02pm Tue 18 Feb 14

seaveiw says...

He may run but cannot hide, note today what has happened with a similar situation in Caerphilly.two top executives and the former monoring officer are now to face charges of gross misconduct in public By the way who is the other person involved he is keeping a low profile
He may run but cannot hide, note today what has happened with a similar situation in Caerphilly.two top executives and the former monoring officer are now to face charges of gross misconduct in public By the way who is the other person involved he is keeping a low profile seaveiw
  • Score: 7

11:49am Thu 20 Feb 14

Justiceforall says...

The electorate want transparency and value for money, PCC offers us neither.
The electorate want transparency and value for money, PCC offers us neither. Justiceforall
  • Score: 5

1:44pm Thu 20 Feb 14

Welshman23 says...

Mike Stoddart wrote:
Martin Lewis,
I agree absolutely with almost everything you say.
However, there is one inaccuracy in your comment: the SRA for cabinet members is £15,000 not £7,000.
And it should also be noted that, as a result of his membership of the ruling clique, Cllr Hancock has recently been appointed as local authority representative on the Hywel Dda Health Board - salary £13,000.
So, if you include his £13,000 basic allowance as a councillor, he is trousering in excess of £40,000 of the taxpayers money.
What price party loyalty when set against that?
£40k per annum for a person that cannot make decisions how do you get on this gravy train is it by supporting Adams & BPJ
For this sort of salary I now join the adams family the house the Addams family lived was falling down a bit like the Kremlin on the Cleddau. The programme was taken off screen lets hope history repeats itself, seek the Kremlin to Wetherspoons.
[quote][p][bold]Mike Stoddart[/bold] wrote: Martin Lewis, I agree absolutely with almost everything you say. However, there is one inaccuracy in your comment: the SRA for cabinet members is £15,000 not £7,000. And it should also be noted that, as a result of his membership of the ruling clique, Cllr Hancock has recently been appointed as local authority representative on the Hywel Dda Health Board - salary £13,000. So, if you include his £13,000 basic allowance as a councillor, he is trousering in excess of £40,000 of the taxpayers money. What price party loyalty when set against that?[/p][/quote]£40k per annum for a person that cannot make decisions how do you get on this gravy train is it by supporting Adams & BPJ For this sort of salary I now join the adams family the house the Addams family lived was falling down a bit like the Kremlin on the Cleddau. The programme was taken off screen lets hope history repeats itself, seek the Kremlin to Wetherspoons. Welshman23
  • Score: 2

8:53am Wed 26 Feb 14

Tttoommy says...

seaveiw wrote:
He may run but cannot hide, note today what has happened with a similar situation in Caerphilly.two top executives and the former monoring officer are now to face charges of gross misconduct in public By the way who is the other person involved he is keeping a low profile
isn't it the finance bod?
[quote][p][bold]seaveiw[/bold] wrote: He may run but cannot hide, note today what has happened with a similar situation in Caerphilly.two top executives and the former monoring officer are now to face charges of gross misconduct in public By the way who is the other person involved he is keeping a low profile[/p][/quote]isn't it the finance bod? Tttoommy
  • Score: 3

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